Uh Oh.....

[poksal]

FYI..
That stuff "may" not be the right instant tank cycle bacteria.. many makers use the same bio mix that is used in sewage plants. That stuff is for a high nitrogen, high ammonia environment. That is NOT what we have in a reef tank by a far cry. That stuff dies and only delays the cycle.

I have "instant cycled" three tanks now with Dr. Tim's "One and Only" and it has worked every time in about three days. ... AND .. you would be darned lucky to catch any nitrate or nitrite cycle.. I haven't caught one yet. To do that cycle method you need a fish at the same time as you add the "One and Only". The fish kicks the bacteria into action. Some cringe, but each time I have used a Clown Fish about two inches long and have never seen any signs of stress. Each time the fish ate like a pig and was very active the whole time. Also, you need about one pound of live rock to each gallon of water. AND, give the live rock a couple of days in the tank before you do the instant cycle.

You can also do the same thing by getting the bacteria from a friend's refuge or sump's sponge or floss squeezings. You are just adding in the bacteria instead of waiting for the water to "spoil" and grow a crop of it... I think it is a no brainer.. IMO..

Like you, I was mighty good with fresh water tanks a few years ago!! .... it ain't the same!

I'm new to reefing and am making plenty of hard lession learning mistakes but I got the cycle thing good and right!

After the cycle the tank needs to mature a while.. that is what mine is doing now. Also, give your self some time to figure it out before you add any serious life forms.

I have found this forum worth a king's ransom and VERY helpful and cooperative.

 

[baeya]

FYI..
That stuff "may" not be the right instant tank cycle bacteria.. many makers use the same bio mix that is used in sewage plants. That stuff is for a high nitrogen, high ammonia environment. That is NOT what we have in a reef tank by a far cry. That stuff dies and only delays the cycle.

I have "instant cycled" three tanks now with Dr. Tim's "One and Only" and it has worked every time in about three days. ... AND .. you would be darned lucky to catch any nitrate or nitrite cycle.. I haven't caught one yet. To do that cycle method you need a fish at the same time as you add the "One and Only". The fish kicks the bacteria into action. Some cringe, but each time I have used a Clown Fish about two inches long and have never seen any signs of stress. Each time the fish ate like a pig and was very active the whole time. Also, you need about one pound of live rock to each gallon of water. AND, give the live rock a couple of days in the tank before you do the instant cycle.

You can also do the same thing by getting the bacteria from a friend's refuge or sump's sponge or floss squeezings. You are just adding in the bacteria instead of waiting for the water to "spoil" and grow a crop of it... I think it is a no brainer.. IMO..

Like you, I was mighty good with fresh water tanks a few years ago!! .... it ain't the same!

I'm new to reefing and am making plenty of hard lession learning mistakes but I got the cycle thing good and right!

After the cycle the tank needs to mature a while.. that is what mine is doing now. Also, give your self some time to figure it out before you add any serious life forms.

I have found this forum worth a king's ransom and VERY helpful and cooperative.

Thank you for your uplifting message. I'm looking forward to seeing your tank! :)

 

[cvcdrk]

What people are trying to explain is that Seahorses are extremely delicate and difficult creatures to care for. They require EXTREMELY stable water parameters (no fluctuations at all) to thrive. They also require a lot of things a newly cycled tank is not going to have.

Do you have gorgs or something for them to attach onto? Do you know what they're going to eat? Many species only eat live food. That is very difficult to accommodate. What is the water movement system like? Is there a sump with an overflow? Is it seahorse-proof yet? Are there pumps in the tank? Do they have covers?

The mandarin will likely be fine. The ORA mandarins are fairly hardy. As long as it eats the frozen you offer it will be fine. You still shouldn't be ordering livestock for a tank that isn't even set up yet, though. That is the point that everyone is trying to convey. As someone who claims to have a lot of fishkeeping experience, it makes little sense that you would effectively waste your money like that.

Both the mandarin and the seahorses are recommended only to very experienced or expert-level saltwater hobbyists. They're also recommended for established tanks (9+ months of continually stable water parameters).

Nobody likes hearing things that they're doing wrong. I get that, however, if I was you, I would cancel the order for the seahorses and get something else. You're effectively flushing that money down the toilet. As for the mandarin, do the best you can....I would recommend acclimating slowly and introducing as much variety in the food as possible. Sometimes the ORA ones will even eat some types of pellet food. My scooter loves Nutramar OVA. Might be worth a try if he doesn't like the mysis.

 

[baeya]

What people are trying to explain is that Seahorses are extremely delicate and difficult creatures to care for. They require EXTREMELY stable water parameters (no fluctuations at all) to thrive. They also require a lot of things a newly cycled tank is not going to have.

Do you have gorgs or something for them to attach onto? Do you know what they're going to eat? Many species only eat live food. That is very difficult to accommodate. What is the water movement system like? Is there a sump with an overflow? Is it seahorse-proof yet? Are there pumps in the tank? Do they have covers?

The mandarin will likely be fine. The ORA mandarins are fairly hardy. As long as it eats the frozen you offer it will be fine. You still shouldn't be ordering livestock for a tank that isn't even set up yet, though. That is the point that everyone is trying to convey. As someone who claims to have a lot of fishkeeping experience, it makes little sense that you would effectively waste your money like that.

Both the mandarin and the seahorses are recommended only to very experienced or expert-level saltwater hobbyists. They're also recommended for established tanks (9+ months of continually stable water parameters).

Nobody likes hearing things that they're doing wrong. I get that, however, if I was you, I would cancel the order for the seahorses and get something else. You're effectively flushing that money down the toilet. As for the mandarin, do the best you can....I would recommend acclimating slowly and introducing as much variety in the food as possible. Sometimes the ORA ones will even eat some types of pellet food. My scooter loves Nutramar OVA. Might be worth a try if he doesn't like the mysis.

Thank you for your input. I respect everyones concerns.

 

[Amba]

I had a mandarin (not ORA) and I was able to train it to eat frozen mysis over the period of a month. They are beautiful fish, and quite simple to take care of besides getting them to eat. Seahorses are another story, you should read the sticky that littlefish made in the, "Seahorses and Pipefish" area of the forum, it will help you quite a bit.

 

[baeya]

I had a mandarin (not ORA) and I was able to train it to eat frozen mysis over the period of a month. They are beautiful fish, and quite simple to take care of besides getting them to eat. Seahorses are another story, you should read the sticky that littlefish made in the, "Seahorses and Pipefish" area of the forum, it will help you quite a bit.

Thanks Amba. I have read it and I've also read the 400+ page class text that oceanrider sends you when requested. Very in depth documents with an e-mail address to the author that will answer any and all questions almost immediately. I will be reading through it several more times before my tank finishes its cycle.

 

[Northstar24]

Who said I'm not testing my tanks? I know where my 65g is at. I have a cycled tank to put the mandarin in. How dare you suggest I didn't research. Find someone else to pick on.

Sorry, what I meant to say was, its no big deal to put a finicky fish in a tank that's still cycling. I'm sure you'll have better luck than all the other aquarists out there

Feel better now that I've coddled you and told you what you wanted to hear? That doesn't change the fact that by your own admission you ordered stock for a tank that wasn't finished cycling

My problem is; I ordered an ORA mandarin and some snails to be delivered the end of next week. I just got an email that it will be delivered tomorrow!

I don't know what to do.....

I'll leave this thread be, and offer advice to those that actually want it, and not those that get all upset when they don't get the confirmation they're looking for

 

[baeya]

Sorry, what I meant to say was, its no big deal to put a finicky fish in a tank that's still cycling. I'm sure you'll have better luck than all the other aquarists out there

Feel better now that I've coddled you and told you what you wanted to hear? That doesn't change the fact that by your own admission you ordered stock for a tank that wasn't finished cyclin


I'll leave this thread be, and offer advice to those that actually want it, and not those that get all upset when they don't get the confirmation they're looking for

I feel so much better now. Thank you. ;)

 

[baeya]

I had a mandarin (not ORA) and I was able to train it to eat frozen mysis over the period of a month. They are beautiful fish, and quite simple to take care of besides getting them to eat. Seahorses are another story, you should read the sticky that littlefish made in the, "Seahorses and Pipefish" area of the forum, it will help you quite a bit.

What did your ORA mandarin eat while you were training it to eat frozen mysis?

 

[SarahSmile]

Most people do not actually want advice. It's a bummer really as this is a scenario that just keeps repeating itself and the animals suffer. Sometimes people just have to make their own costly mistakes.

 

[baeya]

Most people do not actually want advice. It's a bummer really as this is a scenario that just keeps repeating itself and the animals suffer. Sometimes people just have to make their own costly mistakes.

Hi Sara; Nice of you to pitch in. You'll be happy to know that my poor little suffering mandarin is alive and well this morning in his little Evolve2. His permanent home (the 65g) has started to show Nitrates as well. But, he'll be fine where he is right now for awhile longer while his big house stabilizes.
It doesn't look like I'm going to make any friends here because I ordered a fish for my main tank to be delivered in a couple weeks and the company sent it early. I'm doing the best I can with the situation. Lesson learned. Don't order fish before your tank is cycled and stable. I get it.
Would you all rather I flush the mandarin down the toilet to end his suffering since he is going to die a slow death anyways.......?

 

[bjohanson1234]

So how many of you guys haven't made mistakes while putting together your aquarium?

Constantly harping on someone is counter productive. Our job here is to help as best we can given the situation. No point in constantly nit picking about how the tank was set up. Move forward and try to solve the problem.

 

[SarahSmile]

No one needs to get defensive and angry and sarcastic.You post on forums to get advice, opinions, and facts. Right? It's a serious situation and others like to chime in so the OP doesn't think it's just the opinion of 1 or 2. It's a situation where you have seahorses and mandarins, both of which are EXPERT only and they need MATURE, established tanks.That is not an opinion, it is a fact.In this situation they have been ordered for tanks that have not even cycled, so, I believe people are just a bit concerned. What's done is done with the mandarin BUT, No one wants to see seahorses go to a brand new tank and die so we are trying to convince her to not get them. They are extremely difficult to keep. That's all. As Northstar pointed out, this thread is a bit useless as advice is not really wanted here. Do we really have to pussyfoot around the issue?
Do we have to be scared of hurting someone's feelings so we cannot give our opinion or advice or facts? Everyone needs to quit being so sensitive.

 

[baeya]

So how many of you guys haven't made mistakes while putting together your aquarium?

Constantly harping on someone is counter productive. Our job here is to help as best we can given the situation. No point in constantly nit picking about how the tank was set up. Move forward and try to solve the problem.

Thank you. Honestly, I wasn't even thinking about putting him into the Evolve2 when I first posted. I had other plans for the little tank. Since I used LR and LS and it is so small, I'm assuming it didn't take long for it to cycle. Its been sitting in my fish room for a month now. The levels on it are good.
I guess I was just trying to find out if setting up a 10 or 20 gallon SW tank and changing out most of the water everyday with aged SW would have been an option. I would still like to know if something like that is possible for an emergency hospital tank.
I will do a search for information on SW hospital tanks as well.
I am in this situation now and will move forward and do my best for this little mandarin.

 

[little_fish]

Although this probably isn't the best situation for the mandarine, he will likely be fine but do try and avoid this type of situation in the future.

Regarding the seahorse, I absolute do not recommend them as your first fish, and this is speaking from personal experience. All that ocean rider stuff makes it sound like its going to be so easy, and everything will float along without a hitch. I totally bought that and thought I had researched enough to be able handle them as a new reefer. Boy was I ever wrong. It's really tricky learning to get the tank set up right and do the proper maintained and then to put such a fickle animal into the mix, it was more than I could handle and resulted in two dead seahorse. I highly highly highly suggest just starting out with a mixed reef. If you can care for that and grow a successful reef, then I would consider getting seahorse. They are an even bigger commitment than a normal reef.

 

[baeya]

No one needs to get defensive and angry and sarcastic.You post on forums to get advice, opinions, and facts. Right? It's a serious situation and others like to chime in so the OP doesn't think it's just the opinion of 1 or 2. It's a situation where you have seahorses and mandarins, both of which are EXPERT only and they need MATURE, established tanks.That is not an opinion, it is a fact.In this situation they have been ordered for tanks that have not even cycled, so, I believe people are just a bit concerned. What's done is done with the mandarin BUT, No one wants to see seahorses go to a brand new tank and die so we are trying to convince her to not get them. They are extremely difficult to keep. That's all. As Northstar pointed out, this thread is a bit useless as advice is not really wanted here. Do we really have to pussyfoot around the issue?
Do we have to be scared of hurting someone's feelings so we cannot give our opinion or advice or facts? Everyone needs to quit being so sensitive.

Everyone has an opionion and are welcome to it. I'm choosing to take the advise of the people who breed and raise the seahorses and of those that have purchased from them rather than debate this with you. I didn't ask for your permission to get seahorses.

 

[SarahSmile]

Please read Little Fish's post above. It's not an opinion. It's fact. It's like watching a scary movie and seeing the chick in high heels and no bra on run into the woods. We're just staring at the screen yelling "don't run into the woods" cause we all know what's going to happen. But, the girl never listens. Now, I'm out. God bless honey.

 

[Amba]

What did your ORA mandarin eat while you were training it to eat frozen mysis?

My mandarin was not ORA, as I stated in the above post. It ate live foods until it was able to eat frozen.

 

[Amba]

Also, littlefish has kept seahorses herself, and has written a wonderful article about what she learned during the ride. To me, I would rather have someone like that give me advice, someone who has a home aquarium, and has tried seahorses before. Also, littlefish has bansticks, I suggest that you calm down and show a little respect for the people that qualify to keep, "expert only".

 

[Northstar24]

Guys, this is obviously a lost cause, haven't we figured that out yet?

Like I said, the OP is convinced he won't be like every other aquarist out there, and that they're 'special'

Lets help the people that actually want help