SantaMonica
Reefing newb
Thanks for all the comments.
Yes, the air pumps are from Penn Plax, and cheap.
Yes, the air pumps are from Penn Plax, and cheap.
Mega Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover - DIY!
- Thread starter SantaMonica
- Start date
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
Success updates...
Trichome on the CR site: "I took my skimmer out of my 29g sump about 2 months ago. Since then i have not done a water change...I know i should but i am bad about that. I NEVER have to clean my glass in my DT. I don't take water parameters so i can't tell you what mine are, but i do know i don't get any algae in my tank other than bubble algae. I harvest one side of my scrubber about every 2 weeks [needs to be more often]. The water must be pretty clean because my 2 golden striped maroon clowns have spawned, for their first time, about 1 month after i took my skimmer out. Not only are there several people in Cincinnati trying algae scrubbers with great success there is a 50 page thread of people with great success too. 6 month update: I have had my turf scrubber going on my 29g tank for 6 months now without a skimmer. Currently i have 2 Gold Stripped Maroon clownfish, a Yasha gobie, a sixline wrasse, 2 cleaner shrimp, and a candy cane pistol shrimp in the tank, along with several anemones. I have to say everything had been running great! I only have to clean the glass about once a week. Everything in the tank seems to be very happy with the current bio load. I have been doing water changes about once every 2 months (I know i should be doing it more) [not really]. As far as i can tell the turf scrubber has been a success for me and when i move i plan on adding one to my 120g display tank. However, I will not be going skimmerless on the 120g display."
Redwing on the CR site: "I set [my scrubber] up to remove algae from my display tank (and that is exactly what it is doing). But I now I have noticed that my skim-mate is much darker and that I do not have to clean it as much (about once every week not every other day). also like I posted my nitrates have never been undetectable (more like 5+ ppm) so if you ask me [the scrubber] is doing exactly what it is supposed to do. Could I take my skimmer offline maybe but I most likely will not I like knowing that I have backup if something fails [except, skimmers don't remove ammonia, so they won't help]. also my skimmer is a CL125 and I have more than 160 gallons in my hole setup so my skimmer has always been way undersized. (most people would use a skimmer twice that size for this many gallons)"
Mrbncal on the scrubber site: "I have a 75 w/ 30 gallon sump and ran w/o a skimmer for over a year BEFORE I found out about ATS'. There were some things that didnt do well, but anenomes and zoas, most lps did great, montis and a few acros grew fine w/o a skimmer. Bubble algae and hair algae did great also. Since I started running a screen covered in algae my tank has never been healthier. Its been 6 mos or so maybe 7, I have NO hair algae and the bubble algae is losing ground. Almost gone completely. I feed a ton of frozen and oyster feast. I should probably back off some feedings but the coco worms love life and the gorgonians are growing, so why change anything."
Tien on the MFK site: "So I have been running a scrubber on a test tank with goldfish. At one point nitrates were near 80 ppm (I know this is WAY high, but I did this intentionally with the goldfish). I have done no water changes, and my nitrates are now about 7 ppm! and nitrites are zero. I do not have the best set up with lighting yet and the scrubber set up only cost me $25, but it works with fresh water! [yes scrubbers work just as well with FW]. I am going to continue to add goldfish and overstock the tank to see how the scrubber handles it. Looks like I will be building a large scrubber system for the 500 gallon!"
Billy_m24 on the MFK site: "my algee scrubber is working, I finally have purple on my rocks! I have 175 reef tank with 2 400w MH light and 2 blue vho, my nitrate was always very high in the red zone, and now after 2 month [of using the scrubber] I'm running about 10 on the nitrates and I have purple [on the rocks], and my ph stays at 8.2"
Renman303 on the MD site: "I have been running a 4-sheet (8 1/2" x 11") ATS since June '09 with not only no ill effects but, my water is crystal clear! I have unhooked my Deltec AP851 Protein Skimmer in July of '09 (anyone want to buy it?) and have been running solely on the ATS since then (~15 months). I scrape one side of each of the 4 sheets once a month [needs more often!]. I add no chemicals of any kind to the water and only do a 10 percent water change once a week. Salt is much cheaper than chemicals. I don't even use RO/DI water any more. I just run through Carbon as Phosban prior to mixing. Simple....as it should be!"
Vannpytt on the scrubber site: "I'm experiencing massive amounts of live particles in my water. When the lights go out, and I turn on a flashlight, I can see with my bare eyes 1-3mm long shrimplike creatures swimming in the water, jumping on the stones. It's amazing, while the water is so clear, there are still so much life. I'm also experiencing massive critical comments from the local forums claiming I'm destined to fail etc. I still have no values measurable of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate nor phosphate. The pH is fine as well as the salinity. The algae growth [in the tank] that came initially, is slower, and I added 2 lawnmovers to take care of the rest. Coraline is spreading on the live rocks, I added a Sun Coral who seems to be happy, as well as some Zoas."
Vykhang on the scrubber site: "After 4 yrs, it has become so hard to maintain my 300 gal reef/fish tank due to nitrate and phosphate. Just doing 10-15 percent water changes on 300 gal tank per week is driving me crazy not to mention salt cost. After seaching the net and came across this website, I've started my own version of scrubber. It has been running over a year for me and I've not changed (add only) water since (I don't belive in changing water if all chemicals are in spec. The scrubbers are 1" above the water line to minimize the water noise [would be even better to have the screens in the water]. Water line is maintained by electronic sensor. Can't speak for everyone but the results has been absolutelly wonderful. Nitrate and Phosphate are un-detectable. I can't thank Santa Monica enough because little to no water changes. I just maintain chemical additives and add water to my reserve tank."
Yesman on the scrubber site: "I clean it all off completely every 7 days. However as you can see with over 3 pounds in weight of algae every 7 days being scraped off the screen and with nitrates and phosphates at zero, it may be ok to clean this way. Interesting to note that at the bottom of the acrylic box, the water level is about 3 inches with algae growing all over the acrylic and alive with pods, even some amphipods!"
Trichome on the CR site: "I took my skimmer out of my 29g sump about 2 months ago. Since then i have not done a water change...I know i should but i am bad about that. I NEVER have to clean my glass in my DT. I don't take water parameters so i can't tell you what mine are, but i do know i don't get any algae in my tank other than bubble algae. I harvest one side of my scrubber about every 2 weeks [needs to be more often]. The water must be pretty clean because my 2 golden striped maroon clowns have spawned, for their first time, about 1 month after i took my skimmer out. Not only are there several people in Cincinnati trying algae scrubbers with great success there is a 50 page thread of people with great success too. 6 month update: I have had my turf scrubber going on my 29g tank for 6 months now without a skimmer. Currently i have 2 Gold Stripped Maroon clownfish, a Yasha gobie, a sixline wrasse, 2 cleaner shrimp, and a candy cane pistol shrimp in the tank, along with several anemones. I have to say everything had been running great! I only have to clean the glass about once a week. Everything in the tank seems to be very happy with the current bio load. I have been doing water changes about once every 2 months (I know i should be doing it more) [not really]. As far as i can tell the turf scrubber has been a success for me and when i move i plan on adding one to my 120g display tank. However, I will not be going skimmerless on the 120g display."
Redwing on the CR site: "I set [my scrubber] up to remove algae from my display tank (and that is exactly what it is doing). But I now I have noticed that my skim-mate is much darker and that I do not have to clean it as much (about once every week not every other day). also like I posted my nitrates have never been undetectable (more like 5+ ppm) so if you ask me [the scrubber] is doing exactly what it is supposed to do. Could I take my skimmer offline maybe but I most likely will not I like knowing that I have backup if something fails [except, skimmers don't remove ammonia, so they won't help]. also my skimmer is a CL125 and I have more than 160 gallons in my hole setup so my skimmer has always been way undersized. (most people would use a skimmer twice that size for this many gallons)"
Mrbncal on the scrubber site: "I have a 75 w/ 30 gallon sump and ran w/o a skimmer for over a year BEFORE I found out about ATS'. There were some things that didnt do well, but anenomes and zoas, most lps did great, montis and a few acros grew fine w/o a skimmer. Bubble algae and hair algae did great also. Since I started running a screen covered in algae my tank has never been healthier. Its been 6 mos or so maybe 7, I have NO hair algae and the bubble algae is losing ground. Almost gone completely. I feed a ton of frozen and oyster feast. I should probably back off some feedings but the coco worms love life and the gorgonians are growing, so why change anything."
Tien on the MFK site: "So I have been running a scrubber on a test tank with goldfish. At one point nitrates were near 80 ppm (I know this is WAY high, but I did this intentionally with the goldfish). I have done no water changes, and my nitrates are now about 7 ppm! and nitrites are zero. I do not have the best set up with lighting yet and the scrubber set up only cost me $25, but it works with fresh water! [yes scrubbers work just as well with FW]. I am going to continue to add goldfish and overstock the tank to see how the scrubber handles it. Looks like I will be building a large scrubber system for the 500 gallon!"
Billy_m24 on the MFK site: "my algee scrubber is working, I finally have purple on my rocks! I have 175 reef tank with 2 400w MH light and 2 blue vho, my nitrate was always very high in the red zone, and now after 2 month [of using the scrubber] I'm running about 10 on the nitrates and I have purple [on the rocks], and my ph stays at 8.2"
Renman303 on the MD site: "I have been running a 4-sheet (8 1/2" x 11") ATS since June '09 with not only no ill effects but, my water is crystal clear! I have unhooked my Deltec AP851 Protein Skimmer in July of '09 (anyone want to buy it?) and have been running solely on the ATS since then (~15 months). I scrape one side of each of the 4 sheets once a month [needs more often!]. I add no chemicals of any kind to the water and only do a 10 percent water change once a week. Salt is much cheaper than chemicals. I don't even use RO/DI water any more. I just run through Carbon as Phosban prior to mixing. Simple....as it should be!"
Vannpytt on the scrubber site: "I'm experiencing massive amounts of live particles in my water. When the lights go out, and I turn on a flashlight, I can see with my bare eyes 1-3mm long shrimplike creatures swimming in the water, jumping on the stones. It's amazing, while the water is so clear, there are still so much life. I'm also experiencing massive critical comments from the local forums claiming I'm destined to fail etc. I still have no values measurable of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate nor phosphate. The pH is fine as well as the salinity. The algae growth [in the tank] that came initially, is slower, and I added 2 lawnmovers to take care of the rest. Coraline is spreading on the live rocks, I added a Sun Coral who seems to be happy, as well as some Zoas."
Vykhang on the scrubber site: "After 4 yrs, it has become so hard to maintain my 300 gal reef/fish tank due to nitrate and phosphate. Just doing 10-15 percent water changes on 300 gal tank per week is driving me crazy not to mention salt cost. After seaching the net and came across this website, I've started my own version of scrubber. It has been running over a year for me and I've not changed (add only) water since (I don't belive in changing water if all chemicals are in spec. The scrubbers are 1" above the water line to minimize the water noise [would be even better to have the screens in the water]. Water line is maintained by electronic sensor. Can't speak for everyone but the results has been absolutelly wonderful. Nitrate and Phosphate are un-detectable. I can't thank Santa Monica enough because little to no water changes. I just maintain chemical additives and add water to my reserve tank."
Yesman on the scrubber site: "I clean it all off completely every 7 days. However as you can see with over 3 pounds in weight of algae every 7 days being scraped off the screen and with nitrates and phosphates at zero, it may be ok to clean this way. Interesting to note that at the bottom of the acrylic box, the water level is about 3 inches with algae growing all over the acrylic and alive with pods, even some amphipods!"
dcantucson
Reef pro
SantaMonica I still think you should mass market these things in 2-3 different sizes.
kevvin27
Reefing newb
I agree. If you can do it without getting into any legal problems I think it would be really successful. If I had known about algea scrubbers when I was first setting up my tank I would have started out with it right away. Everything in my tank looks so much better now with just the scrubber running then it did when I had a skimmer...and so much easier to clean and quieter too.
coolhandgoose
Reef enthusiast
He does have some setups for sale with different options and even some different sizes I think.
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
I currently only have the SM100. I'm working on the 25. I happen to be working on the patent stuff now, which is taking a lot of time. There are four versions, and the ones that I've been posting are just the first version. The other three I have to wait for patent application before posting or selling them. Meanwhile, yes, I hope the 25 will be available in January...
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
Cleaning Guidelines:
Black/oily growth, but no green: Clean every last bit of it off every three days.
Dark brown growth, but no green: Clean all of it off every 4 days.
Light brown growth, but no green: Clean most of if off every 5 days.
Mostly brown growth, but some green: Clean all of the brown off every 6 days, but leave some of the green.
Half brown and half green growth: Clean most of it off every 7 days.
Mostly green growth: clean most of it off every 10 days.
In all cases, stronger lighting will help you get to green faster, even if the extra lighting is only temporary.
Also, when there is lots of green, you are getting the most filtering. So to minimize nutrient spikes which might occur after cleaning the green off, consider cutting the screen vertically into two halves, and cleaning only one of the halves every 5 days. This give 10 days of growth for each half (about the max you can go), but always leaves the other half to do the filtering.
After several months, you may start getting some thick brown algae that feels like fuzz, and it won't come off. That's turf algae. You don't want turf because it's thick and dark, and it blocks light from reaching the screen (also, because turf does not grow fast enough to be a good filter.) Scrape the turf off with a hack saw blade. Matter of fact, if you start getting turf, you can just start doing all your weekly cleaning with a hack saw blade.
Black/oily growth, but no green: Clean every last bit of it off every three days.
Dark brown growth, but no green: Clean all of it off every 4 days.
Light brown growth, but no green: Clean most of if off every 5 days.
Mostly brown growth, but some green: Clean all of the brown off every 6 days, but leave some of the green.
Half brown and half green growth: Clean most of it off every 7 days.
Mostly green growth: clean most of it off every 10 days.
In all cases, stronger lighting will help you get to green faster, even if the extra lighting is only temporary.
Also, when there is lots of green, you are getting the most filtering. So to minimize nutrient spikes which might occur after cleaning the green off, consider cutting the screen vertically into two halves, and cleaning only one of the halves every 5 days. This give 10 days of growth for each half (about the max you can go), but always leaves the other half to do the filtering.
After several months, you may start getting some thick brown algae that feels like fuzz, and it won't come off. That's turf algae. You don't want turf because it's thick and dark, and it blocks light from reaching the screen (also, because turf does not grow fast enough to be a good filter.) Scrape the turf off with a hack saw blade. Matter of fact, if you start getting turf, you can just start doing all your weekly cleaning with a hack saw blade.
PRC
Stop Quoting Me!
SM have you ever seen the big TCP Brand CFL Bulbs? I've never seen them before. I ran up to Home Depot tonight to get some stuff for work and they were on sale...I'm gonna try it out....The bulb itself is about 9.5" long.. 68W @ 2700k. This may work for me instead of using 2 smaller bulbs...I think I'm gonna give it a shot.
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
That's probably going to burn the algae because of too much power in one spot, unless you back it 12" away and use a big reflector. But then you'll have light all over the place.
It's really better to distribute the light evenly across the screen with several smaller bulbs. Or best, T5HO's.
It's really better to distribute the light evenly across the screen with several smaller bulbs. Or best, T5HO's.
PRC
Stop Quoting Me!
I put it on there earlier tonight (still have my standard CFLs on it too)..I'll let it ride for a day or 2 to see what happens with it..but you're right...I thought I left the light on in the fishroom, it's that light, damn thing is powerful..I'll back it off a little bit per your suggestions and see what happens.
BL1
.............
So, I only read the first couple pages because lets face it, there's a TON to read ... and you said that you want one sq. inch per gallon of tank water ... is it beneficial if you make it larger? Like say I have a 75g and I make mine 9"x9" = 81 sq. inches ... would it benefit me to make it 12x12, or does that end up harming the process?
Also, when you say it should equal your tank volume, does it have to be square shaped (9x9, 12x12, etc) or can it be rectangular (27x3, 10x14, etc)?
Also, when you say it should equal your tank volume, does it have to be square shaped (9x9, 12x12, etc) or can it be rectangular (27x3, 10x14, etc)?
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
More area only helps if there is more light too. Otherwise the additional area does not get enough light and does less filtering.
Shape does not matter.
Shape does not matter.
PRC
Stop Quoting Me!
Santa Monica....you have a PM.
ZyberGoby
Because I'm clever
this was awesome thanks I will have to work this in to my new build that's coming in 2011 :D
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
Here is the micro table saw that I use to cut the slots in the pipes:
Mighty Micro Table Saw at Penn State Industries
It comes with two blades, and if you put them together like a pancake the thickness will be perfect for a 1/8 inch slot for a single layer of plastic canvas. I've cut about 20 slots and the blades are just starting to need replacing. There are other similar micro saws if you search for them ("mini table saw", etc), as well as some slightly larger "mini" table saws which get a bit expensive for just cutting pipes.
Mighty Micro Table Saw at Penn State Industries
It comes with two blades, and if you put them together like a pancake the thickness will be perfect for a 1/8 inch slot for a single layer of plastic canvas. I've cut about 20 slots and the blades are just starting to need replacing. There are other similar micro saws if you search for them ("mini table saw", etc), as well as some slightly larger "mini" table saws which get a bit expensive for just cutting pipes.
BL1
.............
This was the strongest bulb my Lowes had available in 6500k range, will it be strong enough? Shop Bright Effects 18-Watt R40 CFL Bulb at Lowes.com It says that it's equivalent
to a 75w bulb.
to a 75w bulb.
Piratefish
SPS Freak
I order my bulbs from Light Bulbs, Christmas Lights, Rope Lights & More | 1000Bulbs.com You can get almost anything there.
I think SM recommends the 23watt compacts in the 2700-3000k range
I think SM recommends the 23watt compacts in the 2700-3000k range
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BL1
.............
The bulb that was recommended on the second page of this thread was a 23W CFL Flood 65000K, that's why I got the one I did. Would a lower color temp bulb be better? I also would rather not have to order light bulbs online.
PRC
Stop Quoting Me!
Bl1- You want at least 23w. R40....They sell them at home depot and lowes...They're CFL and they're in a blue package..I've never bought any of my lights for my scrubber on line.
SantaMonica
Reefing newb
18 watts would be the minimum. But, the curly-spiral types are better, when you add a reflector to them. You can try the ones you have if you like.
