Fin Rot

If you have read my start up thread you will know our tank is not having the best of times at the moment.

I am fairly confident that my dottyback has fin rot - photo attached.

Not trusting really either of my LFSs at the moment I would be awfully grateful of some advice on the best course of action for treating it. The only other fish we have in the tank at the moment is a percula clown - then shrimps crabs snails and corals.

Do we take him out and treat him in quarantine?? or treat him in the main tank?
we have two chromis in quarantine at the moment (new fish) if we put the dottyback into quarantine what do we do with the chromis? they have only been in there for 10 days.

Also attaching a photo of a coral - which I don't think is very healthy and has not been since cleaning the tank out after is got very dirty when we were away. Any pointers on what we should be doing with this would also be gratefully received.
Thanks so much....not sure if the attachments have worked - will try and see...

You need to test ALL chemistry parameters immediately. If you have not been testing your water it explains a lot. High nitrates and phosphates will kill corals and some fish fin rot. Many fish can tolerate high 'trates but some cannot.

Please post (at the speed of light) your chemistry test results in this post and then we can help you.

Big +1 Sen....and you should never ever treat your display tank (unless you're using flatworm exit to kill flatworms). Inverts and corals can't handle the meds.

If you can catch your fish, you can treat it with Melafix, I believe, but I think it's best used when you first see it. Not sure if you'll be able to help him at this stage. If he's eating, hopefully he'll get better. But definitely check your water parameters, and fix it as needed.

The best thing IMO would be to leave the fish alone to try and let him destress from all the bad water chemistry issues. You know you have them, just work on getting back to stable clean water conditions.

Trying to capture him and treat I think would be much too stressful, especially if he is still eating on his own.

Also, with the chromis if you arent doing true QT with copper or hypo there really isnt a point to QTing them. And i would also either return one chromis or get another one. They do much better in odd numbers. With even numbers they tend to kill each other off.

sen5241b said:

You need to test ALL chemistry parameters immediately. If you have not been testing your water it explains a lot. High nitrates and phosphates will kill corals and some fish fin rot. Many fish can tolerate high 'trates but some cannot.

Please post (at the speed of light) your chemistry test results in this post and then we can help you.

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Hi Sorry - I should have posted all of this here - it was all detailed in my other thread.
Half the problem is everything 'sppears' normal.
Salinity 1.025, Nitrates, Nitrites, ammonia 0, pH 8-8.2, Alkalinity test stuff not working but then have been advised that if that was wrong the pH would be wrong and we also have lots of corraline gro. I have just got a phosphates kit and have tested it and I would say it is between .03 and .1. So it seems this may be a bit high and might explain the coral problem...though the others are flourishing! Is this sorted with a water change or do we add something to the water?

To fill you in though we went away a month ago for 6 days and were told by our LFS to use an auto feeder rather than risk someone over feeding the fish. the tank was a state when we got back and wehad to hae a massive clean which resulted in so much stuff floating around the tank. We have since lost 3 of our fish - one through not eating (blue cheek goby), the second (blue streak cleaner wrasse) appeared as healthy as anything but went a day or so after Number 1 who he was inseperable from. And our male clown stopped eating and just got thinner and thinner. We are envisaging all the problems are from ther state of the tank when we got back.

I read somewhere that with fin rot it is worth doing a 25-50% water change - would you concur??

little_fish said:

The best thing IMO would be to leave the fish alone to try and let him destress from all the bad water chemistry issues. You know you have them, just work on getting back to stable clean water conditions.

Trying to capture him and treat I think would be much too stressful, especially if he is still eating on his own.

Also, with the chromis if you arent doing true QT with copper or hypo there really isnt a point to QTing them. And i would also either return one chromis or get another one. They do much better in odd numbers. With even numbers they tend to kill each other off.

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OK thanks for this! We bought some brineshrimp with garlic which I think is supposed to boost the immune systen a bit - also someone suggested adding lipovit and ummuvit at feeding to again help boost the immune system. do you think this is a good idea?

Re Chromis - ok thanks - why is that (re QTing) if you don't mind me asking???? I would prefer not to have 3 I think. Our LFS said this size tank should take about 10-12 fish - but then I am sure I read on here the other day that we would be looking at more like 7 - 1 per 10 gallons...though this water quantity does exclude sump water...so I don't really want 3 chromis - might return one. thanks

RHillman said:

To fill you in though we went away a month ago for 6 days and were told by our LFS to use an auto feeder rather than risk someone over feeding the fish.

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This is an understandable fear. But I've never had a problem w/ sitters overfeeding because I make it as simple as possible for them by premeasuring everything. Unless they purposely dump the entire contents in the tank, it's a fool-proof way for them. As long as they come once a day (and I do let them skip a day here and there if they can't make it in), they just put one packet in.

Just another example of LFS trying to make a buck by making you feel like the auto-feeder is the better alternative. Maybe for 1 or 2 days, it's an ok alternative if you use pellets. But to put in a week's worth of flakes in a device is scarier to me.

Im not sure what the lipovit and the other thing you listed are, but i would research them before you purchase.

The garlic has never been shown to boost their immune system, but it does act as a stimulant for them to eat. If they are eating they have a much better chance of recovering. But, brine shrimp has very little nutritional value and is more like fish candy. Its ok for a treat once in a while, but they should be feed a variety of different food. Variety is the spice of life and key to good nutrition.

With the QTing, unless you treating the fish with copper or hypo, you are really just observing them. Fish usually dont show signs of disease until they are stressed out, just like us and the common cold. Keep them in good quality water, feed a quality diet and properly stock your tank and you wont likely have a problem with disease.

But because you didnt truly QT the fish you already have in your tank, there is no point to QTing any fish now. The disease is already in your tank, but its a very easy to deal with issue. Most of us dont QT and dont have any problem with disease.

It sounds like you are asking about some sort of vitamin or amino acid supplement (the -vit stuff). If that's what it is, then a lot of people soak the food in something like that. It's a good idea and can only help. It won't hurt. I agree that a big water change is in order with fin rot.

little_fish said:

Im not sure what the lipovit and the other thing you listed are, but i would research them before you purchase.

The garlic has never been shown to boost their immune system, but it does act as a stimulant for them to eat. If they are eating they have a much better chance of recovering. But, brine shrimp has very little nutritional value and is more like fish candy. Its ok for a treat once in a while, but they should be feed a variety of different food. Variety is the spice of life and key to good nutrition. .

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OK so out with the brineshrimp - in with the mysis - what else would you recommend adding? and still do it once a day or might you do it twice and offer less - just in case he is eating less?

little_fish said:

With the QTing, unless you treating the fish with copper or hypo, you are really just observing them. Fish usually dont show signs of disease until they are stressed out, just like us and the common cold. Keep them in good quality water, feed a quality diet and properly stock your tank and you wont likely have a problem with disease. .

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Yes my understanding is that we are observing them - we get most of our fish from a supplier about an hour away and so have been told that the journey could stress them out so best to put in QT for 4 weeks so that if they do come down with something they come down with it in the QT tank rather than infect the main tank.....is there any point in that or not????

little_fish said:

But because you didnt truly QT the fish you already have in your tank, there is no point to QTing any fish now. The disease is already in your tank, but its a very easy to deal with issue. Most of us dont QT and dont have any problem with disease.

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But surely QTing...or observing might stop other diseases being introduced to the tank?

The dottyback is taking mouthfuls of sand and splurting them out...does anyone know if this is a bad sign or if it is a way of ridding himself of something?

Many thanks

Observing for 4 weeks may catch some diseases they bring with them. But not all, because fish can be carrying a disease and not show symptoms.

I have no idea about the eating sand behavior. That sounds weird for a dottyback.

The garlic enriched brine food is fine for the fish to entice their appetite. I just wouldn't rely on it as their sole food source.

Bifferwine said:

Observing for 4 weeks may catch some diseases they bring with them. But not all, because fish can be carrying a disease and not show symptoms.

I have no idea about the eating sand behavior. That sounds weird for a dottyback.

The garlic enriched brine food is fine for the fish to entice their appetite. I just wouldn't rely on it as their sole food source.

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Thanks - yes I agree re the eating sand - it i just like our Goby used to do - but natural to them! Most odd!

We give them mysis shrimp too - would you suggest adding something else? I just want them to have the best diet possible whilst Dotty is recovering!
Thanks

I really like to feed Rod's food, its a pretty good mix of stuff and the fish love it. But i will also drop in some other stuff every now and then. I just go to the fish store and pick up a few different packs of things.

little_fish said:

I really like to feed Rod's food, its a pretty good mix of stuff and the fish love it. But i will also drop in some other stuff every now and then. I just go to the fish store and pick up a few different packs of things.

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I don't think they have much! :( wonder if you can buy online somehow?! It all seems to be either brine or mysis with something added - will go and stake them out tomorrow and assess. Would they like live food??...If I felt I could cope with it/could get hold of it?!

Any idea on the sand eating behaviour? Wondering if it is to relieve some kind of itch? off to look for him as have not seen him for a while! :(

Ive seen my psuedochromis do the same thing every now and then, and I havent really though that much about it.

And dont go down the live food route, that isnt fun at all. Just take a look at what they have next time. Also petco/petsmart are also surprisingly good places to get frozen foods.

little_fish said:

Ive seen my psuedochromis do the same thing every now and then, and I havent really though that much about it.

And dont go down the live food route, that isnt fun at all. Just take a look at what they have next time. Also petco/petsmart are also surprisingly good places to get frozen foods.

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I think being in the UK I am at a severe disadvantage! Will go check tomorrow! Thanks

Mysis is fine if you have that on hand too. I used to make my own food out of seafood from the grocery store. I'd put raw shrimp, clams, mussels, squid, oysters etc. in the blender with some garlic extract and seaweed sheets. Then I'd put the mixture into mini ice cubes to freeze. Smelled nasty, but it ended up being cheaper than buying fish food from the pet store. Just make sure anything you use is raw and unseasoned.

Bifferwine said:

Mysis is fine if you have that on hand too. I used to make my own food out of seafood from the grocery store. I'd put raw shrimp, clams, mussels, squid, oysters etc. in the blender with some garlic extract and seaweed sheets. Then I'd put the mixture into mini ice cubes to freeze. Smelled nasty, but it ended up being cheaper than buying fish food from the pet store. Just make sure anything you use is raw and unseasoned.

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Just bought new test kits today.
Salinity 1.025
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 2 (previously zero)
pH 8-8.2
KH 6.4 - so this is low and we have to add some Coralline Gro. 55ml we think for our 70 gallon tank. Husband has put first syringe in and it has gone a bit bitty - kind of like crystalised salt. Is this right? Should we continue to add the rest? We've never had to add any of this before as the reading has always been fine. So the bottle is 7 months old. We have two bottles and one was a funny colour so have binned this. The other though was unopened and still clear - this is the one that is going 'bitty'.

We have not bought a new ammonia test yet as the shop did not recommend the one they stocked!!! however he has said if I take a sample in tomorrow he will test it for us to see if he agrees with us! I will order this online tonight.


Bought 3 different fish foods today: prawns, mussels and a 5 type mix with seaweed in it too - so will see how Dotty takes to those tonight.

He seems to still be eating well. Can't work out if he is looking any better or not! He is swimming vertically and flicking his tail a lot...not sure if that means anything!

Coralline grow stuff probably won't do anything for the Alk, they are usually just calcium products. And does it look like salt when it hits the water or before?

And that sounds yummy for the fish, I bet they will like it

Here is a good article:

Reef Aquarium Water Parameters by Randy Holmes-Farley - Reefkeeping.com

Alkalinity of 6.4 is borderline low, but not too bad. There are products to raise alkalinity. I couldn't find online what the Coralline Gro contains, but it does say it's a buffer. Like Hannah said, most coralline accelerators are calcium supplements.