Starting my own tank in the next year or so...need your help!

[Potrice]

I'm planning to start my new tank next year. When I was younger, my parents used to have a saltwater aquarium. They kept it for a couple of years and now it is sitting in the garage. The tank is a 92g corner aquarium and they still have all the equipment for it (the stand, the top, lights, skimmer, heater, etc.). It has been sitting there for a couple of years so I have no clue if the tank is still good. I'm currently keeping my money to start my project.

My goal: I want a couple of BIG FISH. I prefer size over quantity. I'm not interested (at least for now) in corals or reef. I guess I want a FO or a FOWLR? Can someone explain the difference? Ideally, I want a big hippo tang, a yellow tang and an angelfish. I'm only 24 years old so my budget is kind of limited. I suppose a FO/FOWLR is less expensive than a reef/coral tank? My favorite fish is the blue hippo tang, and I want a big one (I heard they can get like 12 inches long?) but I'm slightly confused because on some sites they say the minimum tank size to keep them is 75g and some other sites say 120g and even 180g? So here comes my big dilemma...

Scenario 1: I keep my 92g tank and get the fish that I can get. The pros, if the tank is still good, I already have all the equipment so its easier on the wallet. The cons, it is a corner tank and I doubt I'll be able to keep big fish in there :(

Scenario 2: I sell my 92g tank and get a much bigger aquarium that can be big enough for 6-7 inch fish. The pros, they have enough room to swim. New tank, new stand, everything is brand new so I know it will be reliable and safe. The cons, my wallet takes a beating (unless I can get a used one on kijiji or craigslist? Would you recommend a used tank). Can I use the same equipment from the 92g tank on a bigger tank? I know I'll need more lights, but is the skimmer and the heater good enough? Or I need to upgrade everything?

Am I crazy for wanting to start with a big tank? Like a 200g? Should I just stick with my 92g (if its still good)?

The project is far away, but still, I want to get an idea and take plenty of time to think about this while I save my money.

Thanks for your advice,

Potrice

 

[chuysvt]

get a bigger tank....the tank is too small for tangs...... they need alot of space... bigger is always better.... its better to start they right way....

 

[poksal]

FOWLR = Fish Only with Live Rock.

These days we use live rock.. (LR) for the main filtering method.. we recommend more than one pound of LR per gallon. Then we run some kind of sump. The sump can hang (HOB) on the back or be under the display tank in the stand. That is where the skimmer usually hangs out. Generally the LR is arranged to look like a reef. The natural bacteria and other creatures inhabit the reef. Many add additional LR to the sump. The more LR the better. We tend to use a strong population of clean up crew (CUC) of various snails, hermits, stars, crabs, shrimps, etc who also inhabit the reef as an important link to the eco system. These creatures add special viewing interests to the display as well.

So it sounds to me like your budget (you aren't alone these days) dictates you need to start with the 92. There are many really cool choices of creatures that can live there. If you go with a 200 gal your budget can easily get close to $10,000.

But in the mean time, you have much brain food to dig for and many things to do before you start adding fish, so there is plenty of time to figure which fish out. Hang out and join in.... that will be your next step towards getting up to speed to make wiser choices. :D

 

[Potrice]

FOWLR = Fish Only with Live Rock.

These days we use live rock.. (LR) for the main filtering method.. we recommend more than one pound of LR per gallon. Then we run some kind of sump. The sump can hang (HOB) on the back or be under the display tank in the stand. That is where the skimmer usually hangs out. Generally the LR is arranged to look like a reef. The natural bacteria and other creatures inhabit the reef. Many add additional LR to the sump. The more LR the better. We tend to use a strong population of clean up crew (CUC) of various snails, hermits, stars, crabs, shrimps, etc who also inhabit the reef as an important link to the eco system. These creatures add special viewing interests to the display as well.

So it sounds to me like your budget (you aren't alone these days) dictates you need to start with the 92. There are many really cool choices of creatures that can live there. If you go with a 200 gal your budget can easily get close to $10,000.

But in the mean time, you have much brain food to dig for and many things to do before you start adding fish, so there is plenty of time to figure which fish out. Hang out and join in.... that will be your next step towards getting up to speed to make wiser choices. :D

10 000$! Holy molly! I suppose the big cost here is the amount of live rock? So what is a FO tank? No live rock? Wouldn't that be cheaper? Unless you don't recommend it? Maybe I could find a used tank on kijiji or something. Darn, that sucks :(

 

[Waddi]

Kijiji is a good bet bud.
I really dont think you will get close to 10 grand.
If you are a good DIY'er it will help a lot. You could buy a bare tank, build your own stand solely of 4x4 and 2x4 and some MDF or Plywood ect. Build your own LEDs, which gives you no limits on coral if you choose it. Then some equipment, like pumps, skimmers ect, you can grab off kijiji for a steal.
The rock may set you back a bit, but if you buy mainly dry, it will be a lot cheaper.

 

[Potrice]

Kijiji is a good bet bud.
I really dont think you will get close to 10 grand.
If you are a good DIY'er it will help a lot. You could buy a bare tank, build your own stand solely of 4x4 and 2x4 and some MDF or Plywood ect. Build your own LEDs, which gives you no limits on coral if you choose it. Then some equipment, like pumps, skimmers ect, you can grab off kijiji for a steal.
The rock may set you back a bit, but if you buy mainly dry, it will be a lot cheaper.

Do you know any good sites to buy an aquarium? Or is it just a better option to get a used one on kijiji? Thanks for your help Waddi.

 

[Potrice]

One more thing. Does anyone have some kind of online guide or book that explains EVERYTHING about saltwater aquariums? Like what the heck is a RO/DI? I'm a total newbie here that knows nothing lol. I want to educate myself while I save some money to start my project!

 

[poksal]

RODI.... reverse osmosis with de-ionization

If you use the search you will learn lots.

I still say if you do a 200 gallon right, all said and done you will have near $10,000 in it when it is totally up and running.. fully coral and all.

I have the books to show my $95 gallon has consumed $5,500 this year. I started it in September. ... and I got the tank, skimmer and sump for $550.

 

[BL1]

There's no way, when I moved I priced out a custom 8 foot tank, AI LEDs and 3 MP40s with LR and everything for under 10,000. If you go over that for a standard 200 then you're wasting money somewhere.

 

[wontonflip]

I think your tank could go for $10k if you buy everything custom ;) But I highly doubt it would go that high, especially for a FOWLR, since you don't have to spend so much on lighting. Plus there's always craigslist. I got my predrilled 125g for $200 on there. Used, but it works! So I imagine if you look hard enough, you can find a predrilled $200g for way under $1k.

Check out http://livesaquaria.com for fish tank size requirements...that will give you an idea of the size you'll need for certain fish. Always go for the biggest you can afford/fit in your living space.

 

[emily120289]

IMO, I would probably stick with the 92g .. When I began the saltwater hobby I purchased a 100g aquarium.. and Ive since learned the bigger the tank the more money you spend :). As of now I have a 37g soon to be reef, and have learned that if you go smaller in size and save some money, it opens up your budget for equipment upgrades. (RO/DI System, aqua controllers, pumps, LED lighting etc.) Ive also learned that starting small, makes it a little bit easier to learn the ins and outs of the saltwater aquarium hobby. Chemistry, Maintence, etc. It kind of builds a foundation from where to start from for the beginner hobbyist. (Of course this is only my opinion and what worked best for me) I would stick with the 92 if its readily available to you.. gain some knowledge about the hobby and work your way up from there :).

For tangs, I wouldnt say that it "really" matters how many gallons a tank has.. but more so how long the tank is.. Tangs are active swimmers and need the space. I would opt for anything 6ft or more to keep majority of the tangs out there.

 

[dannyboy]

If you have a good local fish store, ask to put up a small sign, "wtb live rock." You'll be amazed how many people down size and are left with rock and sand they cant fit. I just moved about 75 lbs of live sand into my garage where it will die soon and my sump is jam packed with live rock cuz I couldn't find any one to take it. I can't see it costing 10k unless you buy on impulse and usually have to replace that buy.

 

[Bifferwine]

Since you are on a budget, definitely get a used tank and stand. You will end up saving so much more money than if you bought it new.

 

[Samhain]

You can certainly do things on a limited budget, even big tanks. Since you're looking at FOWLR (no coral), one thing you can scrimp on is lighting. For a blue hippo tang, you want at a BARE MINIMUM 6 feet of lateral swimming space. 180+ gallons is what you need for a blue hippo, so if that's your dream fish, then start with a set up that can accommodate it.

Since you are starting to research a year in advance, you have plenty of time to look for deals. Join a local reefing club. You can quite often find great deals on equipment and livestock when members downgrade, upgrade, or go in a different direction with their tanks. If you're willing to do a DIY stand, you can save money there, but if your carpentry skills aren't the best, go with a premade one. You really don't want your DIY stand to collapse under the weight of the tank, water, and rocks!

Also, what kind of home are you living in? Does it have a crawlspace or a basement? If so, you may want to reinforce the floor underneath where the tank will be. Again, don't want things collapsing under the weight of the tank!

A quick list of things you need:
Tank
Stand
Sump (tank that is plumbed to your display tank where you can hide the equipment and refugium, usually but not always smaller than the display tank)
Skimmer
Overflow/Return pump assembly
Heater
Rock (Can be mostly dry rock that you "seed" with a few pieces of live rock)
Test kits
Lighting

A quick list of things that are really nice, but not strictly necessary:
-Reverse Osmosis/Deionization filter (this means you can filter your own water instead of buying it. in this hobby you DO NOT want to use unfiltered tap water. it's usually loaded with chemicals and metals that can be lethal to your fish, and most non RO/DI filters can't remove them)
-Phosphate reactor (helps remove waste that your skimmer won't remove, keeps water cleaner)
-Carbon reactor (another type of filtration for your tank)
-Refugium (place to grow amphipods, which are fish food, and beneficial algae, like chaeto, which provide additional filtration and water cleansing)
-Quarantine Tank (a separate tank where you quarantine and medicate/treat new additions for a period of several weeks prior to addition to the main display tank. treatments may include hyposalinity, antibiotics, etc. also allows you to ensure your new addition is eating well before adding it to your display)

The reactors and refugium can be placed directly in/on your sump. The RO/DI can be attached to your system with it's own dedicated line to your home's plumbing for automatic top off, or you can attach it to a separate faucet and manually add the water to the sump. The quarantine tank is kept entirely separate from your main system, and can be bare bottom with PVC pipes as hiding spots and minimal lighting.

Anyway, you can find almost all this stuff gently used by surfing reef club ads, craigslist, and kijiji. If you're going to be lightly stocked with just a few (5-6) larger fish and no coral, you can probably get away with just a skimmer and regular water changes, although the refugium and reactors will make life easier for you. Take your time and look around. You will find the deals if you are thorough and patient.

 

[Potrice]

You can certainly do things on a limited budget, even big tanks. Since you're looking at FOWLR (no coral), one thing you can scrimp on is lighting. For a blue hippo tang, you want at a BARE MINIMUM 6 feet of lateral swimming space. 180+ gallons is what you need for a blue hippo, so if that's your dream fish, then start with a set up that can accommodate it.

Since you are starting to research a year in advance, you have plenty of time to look for deals. Join a local reefing club. You can quite often find great deals on equipment and livestock when members downgrade, upgrade, or go in a different direction with their tanks. If you're willing to do a DIY stand, you can save money there, but if your carpentry skills aren't the best, go with a premade one. You really don't want your DIY stand to collapse under the weight of the tank, water, and rocks!

Also, what kind of home are you living in? Does it have a crawlspace or a basement? If so, you may want to reinforce the floor underneath where the tank will be. Again, don't want things collapsing under the weight of the tank!

A quick list of things you need:
Tank
Stand
Sump (tank that is plumbed to your display tank where you can hide the equipment and refugium, usually but not always smaller than the display tank)
Skimmer
Overflow/Return pump assembly
Heater
Rock (Can be mostly dry rock that you "seed" with a few pieces of live rock)
Test kits
Lighting

A quick list of things that are really nice, but not strictly necessary:
-Reverse Osmosis/Deionization filter (this means you can filter your own water instead of buying it. in this hobby you DO NOT want to use unfiltered tap water. it's usually loaded with chemicals and metals that can be lethal to your fish, and most non RO/DI filters can't remove them)
-Phosphate reactor (helps remove waste that your skimmer won't remove, keeps water cleaner)
-Carbon reactor (another type of filtration for your tank)
-Refugium (place to grow amphipods, which are fish food, and beneficial algae, like chaeto, which provide additional filtration and water cleansing)
-Quarantine Tank (a separate tank where you quarantine and medicate/treat new additions for a period of several weeks prior to addition to the main display tank. treatments may include hyposalinity, antibiotics, etc. also allows you to ensure your new addition is eating well before adding it to your display)

The reactors and refugium can be placed directly in/on your sump. The RO/DI can be attached to your system with it's own dedicated line to your home's plumbing for automatic top off, or you can attach it to a separate faucet and manually add the water to the sump. The quarantine tank is kept entirely separate from your main system, and can be bare bottom with PVC pipes as hiding spots and minimal lighting.

Anyway, you can find almost all this stuff gently used by surfing reef club ads, craigslist, and kijiji. If you're going to be lightly stocked with just a few (5-6) larger fish and no coral, you can probably get away with just a skimmer and regular water changes, although the refugium and reactors will make life easier for you. Take your time and look around. You will find the deals if you are thorough and patient.

Thank you Samhain!

I'm searching all over craigslist and kijiji daily to find a used tank and some used equipment. I'm not really good with carpentry so I guess I'll buy a stand. How big would you recommend the sump to be? 50g? Concerning the skimmer, how big does it have to be for a 200g? And since I'll be FOWLR, what type of lighting do you recommend? Should I go straight to LED's or it's not worth it since I won't have coral?

Thanks for your time Samhain!

 

[Samhain]

Thank you Samhain!

I'm searching all over craigslist and kijiji daily to find a used tank and some used equipment. I'm not really good with carpentry so I guess I'll buy a stand. How big would you recommend the sump to be? 50g? Concerning the skimmer, how big does it have to be for a 200g? And since I'll be FOWLR, what type of lighting do you recommend? Should I go straight to LED's or it's not worth it since I won't have coral?

Thanks for your time Samhain!

Sump size is really up to you, although 50 would probably be fine on a 200. The sump is ultimately a place to hide equipment and increase total water volume, so get the size that will do what you need it to do.

Skimmers have ratings on them (i.e. rated for up to 50g, up to 75g, up to 180g, etc.). Typically you want to overshoot this. For instance, I have a 90g setup, but my skimmer is rated for up to 150g. Better to overfilter than under.

As for lighting, unless you are just wanting to budget for the fancy LED lighting, it's not really necessary for a FOWLR tank. You can get away with power compacts, T8s, T5s, or whatever visually appeals to you. LEDs are great, and they provide beautiful lighting. I have LEDs over both my tanks, and many many of the members here prefer the LEDs, but unless you feel like dropping the money on them, they aren't the only option out there for a FOWLR tank. And they certainly aren't the most budget conscious for a FOWLR tank. But hey, if you can find a deal on an LED setup from someone upgrading, downgrading, or changing directions, GO FOR IT! They do consume far less electricity and run much cooler than the other lighting options out there.

 

[Potrice]

Hello guys! I've been looking on kijiji for over a month now and still haven't found anything special that grabbed my attention.

I have, however, spotted this website: Quality Custom Aquarium Manufacturer | Toronto Canada

Has anyone bought an aquarium from them before? Any feedback? I was thinking of getting the 125g rectangle (72x18x24) (priced at 495$) since I want tangs and was told the longer the tank, the better it is.

Now lets say I hear good reviews about Miracles and decide to pull the trigger...should I go with Starfire glass? Its more expensive (720$), but is it worth it?

And what about the 'trim'? I'm a complete newbie here and have no clue what is trimless, eurotrim/eurobracing? Can someone explain the difference to me and the possible options?

And last question, with the dimensions of the tank, should I go with dual overflow (corner I guess?) or a single overflow should be enough? And what size should the drilled holes be? There's a bunch of sizes to choose from, ranging from 3/4' to 4'.

Thanks for your help!

Potrice

 

[Neno reefs]

Hello guys! I've been looking on kijiji for over a month now and still haven't found anything special that grabbed my attention.

I have, however, spotted this website: Quality Custom Aquarium Manufacturer | Toronto Canada

Has anyone bought an aquarium from them before? Any feedback? I was thinking of getting the 125g rectangle (72x18x24) (priced at 495$) since I want tangs and was told the longer the tank, the better it is.

Now lets say I hear good reviews about Miracles and decide to pull the trigger...should I go with Starfire glass? Its more expensive (720$), but is it worth it?

And what about the 'trim'? I'm a complete newbie here and have no clue what is trimless, eurotrim/eurobracing? Can someone explain the difference to me and the possible options?

And last question, with the dimensions of the tank, should I go with dual overflow (corner I guess?) or a single overflow should be enough? And what size should the drilled holes be? There's a bunch of sizes to choose from, ranging from 3/4' to 4'.

Thanks for your help!

Potrice

That size of tank should work fine for most tangs,

If i am correct starfire glass is just a clearer fancy glass. So it depends on you if you want to go for cheap tank or fancy tank. (I personaly wouldn't pay a extra 300 for it, but...)

Trimless tanks are again just mainly for looks, i dont think they serve any other pourpess. . (I actualy like haveing a trim on my tank)

 

[Ted]

+1 neno